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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:55 am 
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Curious Earl, what organization is that at?
i don't see how Goodbye Earl is so offensive.
In my experience, What Alan has described GENERALLY describes the private organizations (especially VFW, DAV, and Legion), but there are definitely exceptions no doubt. My Eagles Aerie is getting younger lately and it has caused a boon in their attendance. when we started 5 years ago, i used to joke with my wife about the SCUBA brigade getting out after the meeting....everyone rolling out with their oxygen tanks to have a PBR and smoke. same 5 songs per person in the same order and only off their discs because my SC8347-03 does not sound like their SC8347-03 that the other KJ burned for them.
lately the officers have been getting younger and so have the patrons and by younger i mean early 50's.
but...if we removed any song somebody thought was offensive, we would be out of business.
Goodbye Earl?...
Lefty Frizzell, “Long Black Veil”
Johnny Horton, “When It’s Springtime in Alaska (It’s Forty Below)”
Marty Robbins, “Big Iron”
Vickie Lawrence, “The Night the Lights Went Out in Georgia”
Johnny Cash.... pick your song....
"Folsom Prison Blues," "Cocaine Blues," "Delia's Gone," "Don't Take Your Guns to Town," "Ballad of Annie Palmer", "Banks of The Ohio"
Garth Brooks, "The Thunder Rolls"
Blake Shelton, "Ol' Red"
Garth Brooks, "Papa Loved Mama"
Kenny Rogers, "Coward of the County"

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:58 am 
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wow, what a Liberal lot you are! LOL That would explain some things. I didn't say ban these songs, I just thought it would be a good idea if the manufacturers identified the songs with dodgy lyrics. We're not all working in bars that aren't bothered about such lyrics! It's strange but I don't hear lyrics any way. I've always just hear the music. Not the case with every one though. It would, at least, be nice to be aware there could be some words that might not be appropriate to be hear at the place you are working at.


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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:26 am 
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Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
Curious Earl, what organization is that at?
i don't see how Goodbye Earl is so offensive.
In my experience, What Alan has described GENERALLY describes the private organizations (especially VFW, DAV, and Legion), but there are definitely exceptions no doubt. My Eagles Aerie is getting younger lately and it has caused a boon in their attendance. when we started 5 years ago, i used to joke with my wife about the SCUBA brigade getting out after the meeting....everyone rolling out with their oxygen tanks to have a PBR and smoke. same 5 songs per person in the same order and only off their discs because my SC8347-03 does not sound like their SC8347-03 that the other KJ burned for them.
lately the officers have been getting younger and so have the patrons and by younger i mean early 50's.
but...if we removed any song somebody thought was offensive, we would be out of business.
Goodbye Earl?...
Lefty Frizzell, “Long Black Veil”
Johnny Horton, “When It’s Springtime in Alaska (It’s Forty Below)”
Marty Robbins, “Big Iron”
Vickie Lawrence, “The Night the Lights Went Out in Georgia”
Johnny Cash.... pick your song....
"Folsom Prison Blues," "Cocaine Blues," "Delia's Gone," "Don't Take Your Guns to Town," "Ballad of Annie Palmer", "Banks of The Ohio"
Garth Brooks, "The Thunder Rolls"
Blake Shelton, "Ol' Red"
Garth Brooks, "Papa Loved Mama"
Kenny Rogers, "Coward of the County"


Paradigm,,, it wasn't Earl's shows that had a problem with the song "Goodbye Earl", it was one of my old ones... And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song. She butchered it into some sort of "ex-husband hating" string of profanity, aimed at her ex husband that was in the room. It was bad and very offensive. It's those type of performances that should be curbed, not necessarily the song itself, unless the lyrics are so hateful and incite a lot of negative responses from the existing crowd. And even that is only when the owner of the business says it's not appropriate for such language or behavior.


Last edited by mrscott on Tue Sep 10, 2019 6:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 7:07 am 
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Anybody can find "any" song offensive. Whether it's a song by The Beatles or The Dixie Chicks, there will be those who will find them offensive. To them I say: Please stay home. You have no place being in a bar. You will obviously not have a good time. And I wouldn't recommend going to the movies either. You'll probably find them just as offensive since just about every movie contains violence, nudity, profanity, etc. Your best bet is to stay home and read the Bible.

To everyone else: Go out and have a good time. Sing what you want and have fun!

***Note To Karaoke Hosts***

If you feel the need to "censor" what a person should sing just because you don't like it, please get out of this business.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 7:27 am 
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mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 7:51 am 
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Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".


This particular "lady" (I use that term very loosely tho) was changing song lyrics and using such profanity directed solely to her ex. Her disdain for him was obvious and in my opinion was downright uncalled for in a public place. If we allow such behavior at any time, it can and will become a free-for-all to anyone who wants to vent, and do it on stage. Not cool in my book, and extremely inappropriate,,,, let alone showing how low a person can stoop. It wasn't fun or entertaining for anyone. But until someone says (bar owner/staff/host) or does something to have the rules state that such behavior/language won't be tolerated, then you are asking for feeling to be hurt and/or people to be greatly offended. It can and will get out of hand unless we do our jobs and take a stance against it.


Last edited by mrscott on Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:07 am 
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mrscott wrote:
Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".


This particular "lady" (I use that term very loosely tho) was changing song lyrics and using such profanity directed solely to her ex. Her disdain for him was obvious and in my opinion was downright uncalled for in a public place. If we allow such behavior at any time, it can and will become a free-for-all to anyone who wants to vent, and do it on stage. Not cool in my book, and extremely inappropriate,,,, let alone showing how low a person can stoop. It wasn't fun or entertaining for anyone. But until someone says (bar owner/staff/host) or does something to have the rules state that such behavior/language won't be tolerated, then you are asking for feeling to be hurt and/or people to be greatly offended. I can and will get out of hand unless we do our jobs and take a stance against it.

I totally agree with this. Leave your dirty laundry at home. The stage is not a platform to for you to "vent" about your personal business. Go find somewhere else to create drama.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:16 am 
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Songs that have "questionable" lyrics written into them for whatever reason that the song writer has created are usually meant to add some sort of "meaning" or enhancement to a point that the song writer is trying to convey. Other times it's simply a form of sensationalism to try and evoke a "persona of the artist". Sometimes that IS appropriate, sometimes it's only the writers inability to use different words to say the same thing. We as hosts need to know when and when not to allow such songs to be performed, given our individual venue/event rules.

Just because we are supposed to have freedom of speech, does not mean that there are not consequences for saying anything we want to say. Let's use this as an example. You are asked to do a wedding where grandmas, grandpas, aunties, little children, clergymen , etc. are present. You are hired to provide good "fun" entertainment where karaoke and dancing will be the expected type of activity at the reception. Some well meaning "friend" asks to sing a song, and chooses the song "D-I-V-O-R-C-E", just because he or she "can" and thinks it would be funny. Would you think that would be "appropriate" and you would allow it to be sang, simply because it's his/her "freedom of speech"? Or someone chooses to sing Crunk Juice by 'lil Jon"..??? Simply because he/she LOVES that song and thinks its "fun" to sing...... I doubt very much a host would allow such types of songs to be performed at a wedding.

Then why would you let some someone get away with that type of behavior when you know for a fact it is going to cause someone in the room to be offended? If your type of venue IS that type of clientele, then, fine, let it be sung. But not all venues are the same. Figure out and know what is and isn't appropriate before you push play.

Labeling of songs that could be deemed "adult or offensive" would be helpful if the producers and manufacturers would do so. But, since they don't,, it's up to us as hosts to figure it out first.


Last edited by mrscott on Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:24 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:18 am 
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Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
Curious Earl, what organization is that at?"


That picture is from my regular Thursday night gig... I've been hosting there for going on 15 years.. It's a service club called The Canadian Belgian Dutch Club, or CBD for short, although most of the patrons simply call it "The Club". I can't recall ever having fewer than 24 singers, and our long-standing record is 71.. Normally we're in the 35-ish range.

We do get our share of patrons in the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and even 80s age groups... but as can be seen, we also get 20-somethings, so contrary to what Alan wants you all to believe, NOT ALL service clubs are akin to mortuarys.

We get similar groups at our Saturday night gigs at the Moose Lodge... In fact, many of the same people. Neither establishment would be considered a bar where any and all lyrics are appropriate.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:22 am 
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mrscott wrote:
Songs that have "questionable" lyrics written into them for whatever reason that the song writer has created are usually meant to add some sort of "meaning" or enhancement to a point that the song writer is trying to convey. Other times it's simply a form of sensationalism to try and evoke a "persona of the artist". Sometimes that IS appropriate, sometimes it's only the writers inability to use different words to say the same thing. We as hosts need to know when and when not to allow such songs to be performed, given our individual venue/event rules.

Just because we are supposed to have freedom of speech, does not mean that there are not consequences for saying anything we want to say. Let's use this as an example. You are asked to do a wedding where grandmas, grandpas, aunties, little children, clergymen , etc. are present. You are hired to provide good "fun" entertainment where karaoke and dancing will be the expected type of activity at the reception. Some well meaning "friend" asks to sing a song, and chooses the song "D-I-V-O-R-C-E", just because he or she "can" and thinks it would be funny. Would you think that would be "appropriate" and you would allow it to be sang, simply because it's his/her "freedom of speech"? Or someone chooses to sing Crunk Juice by 'lil Jon"..??? Simply because he/she LOVES that song and thinks its "fun" to sing...... I doubt very much a host would allow such types of songs to be performed at a wedding.

Then why would you let some someone get away with that type of behavior when you know for a fact it is going to cause someone in the room to be offended? If your type of venue IS that type of clientele, then, fine, let it be sung. But not all venues are the same. Figure out and know what is and isn't appropriate before you push play.

Labeling of songs that could be deemed "adult or offensive" would be helpful if the producers and manufacturers would do so. But, since they don't,, it's up to us as hosts to figure it out first.


It is so refreshing to read a well-reasoned, sensible post such as this one. Thanks Mr. Scott.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:15 pm 
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mrscott wrote:
Songs that have "questionable" lyrics written into them for whatever reason that the song writer has created are usually meant to add some sort of "meaning" or enhancement to a point that the song writer is trying to convey. Other times it's simply a form of sensationalism to try and evoke a "persona of the artist". Sometimes that IS appropriate, sometimes it's only the writers inability to use different words to say the same thing. We as hosts need to know when and when not to allow such songs to be performed, given our individual venue/event rules.

Just because we are supposed to have freedom of speech, does not mean that there are not consequences for saying anything we want to say. Let's use this as an example. You are asked to do a wedding where grandmas, grandpas, aunties, little children, clergymen , etc. are present. You are hired to provide good "fun" entertainment where karaoke and dancing will be the expected type of activity at the reception. Some well meaning "friend" asks to sing a song, and chooses the song "D-I-V-O-R-C-E", just because he or she "can" and thinks it would be funny. Would you think that would be "appropriate" and you would allow it to be sang, simply because it's his/her "freedom of speech"? Or someone chooses to sing Crunk Juice by 'lil Jon"..??? Simply because he/she LOVES that song and thinks its "fun" to sing...... I doubt very much a host would allow such types of songs to be performed at a wedding.

Then why would you let some someone get away with that type of behavior when you know for a fact it is going to cause someone in the room to be offended? If your type of venue IS that type of clientele, then, fine, let it be sung. But not all venues are the same. Figure out and know what is and isn't appropriate before you push play.

Labeling of songs that could be deemed "adult or offensive" would be helpful if the producers and manufacturers would do so. But, since they don't,, it's up to us as hosts to figure it out first.

I totally agree with you as far as thy type of venue is concerned. Of course, at a wedding where there are children, grandparents, clergy, etc., certain types of songs would not be appropriate. And I wouldn't allow them either. However a bar is a different story. And anyone who goes to a bar for karaoke has to accept the fact that someone may sing songs that they don't like and find offensive. And I'm not just talking about songs with explicit lyrics either. But that's just the way it is. I don't censor my customers. You're welcome to sing what you want. We call that having fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:25 pm 
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Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".
They would have been stopped in their tracks at my show due to the bar's rule against F bombs on the mic.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 12:51 pm 
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Please understand that in life, as the saying goes, you can't please all of the people all of the time. There's always going to be people who will complain and find fault with everything. It doesn't matter if we're talking about music, movies, restaurants, clothing, cars... you name it, there will be people who will find something to complain about.

But in our business, we must cater to the majority. I'm sure you all heard your customers complaining about one thing or another. Whether it's about a singer, their song selection or the waitresses clothes. It happens all the time.

I am not going to appease the few who complain in lieu of the majority of people who are having a good time. If something is offensive to you, then leave.

Let's put it another way... If I went out to see a movie and complained because I found it offensive... Do you think they're going to stop showing it just because I didn't like it? I don't think so. Especially since everyone else in the theater is enjoying it. My choice is to get up and leave.

In all of the venues that I host karaoke, I rarely get any complaints from customers regarding someone's song selection. And all of the owners of these establishments have no problem allowing anything to be sang. I'm sure that while not everyone may not like it, they tolerate it because they are aware that offensive (or what they find offensive) songs may be sung.

You want to know what I find offensive? Someone too drunk who's acting totally stupid.

So again, I say.. sing whatever floats your boat and have fun. And if one or two people find what you're singing offensive... Oh well.

I am willing to bet that, unless you are a saint with wings and a halo, just about everyone in that karaoke bar uses offensive and explicit language as part of their vocabulary. So, if anyone of these people were to complain about someone singing a song containing the same language makes them all hypocrites.

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 6:53 pm 
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Yep but I can stop what goes on over the mic!

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:57 am 
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Lonman wrote:
Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".
They would have been stopped in their tracks at my show due to the bar's rule against F bombs on the mic.



Maybe, but they'd have got the first one in, as you'd not know it was coming


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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:05 am 
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mrscott wrote:
Paradigm,,, it wasn't Earl's shows that had a problem with the song "Goodbye Earl", it was one of my old ones... And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song. She butchered it into some sort of "ex-husband hating" string of profanity, aimed at her ex husband that was in the room. It was bad and very offensive. It's those type of performances that should be curbed, not necessarily the song itself, unless the lyrics are so hateful and incite a lot of negative responses from the exiting crowd. And even that is only when the owner of the business says it's not appropriate for such language or behavior.

sorry, i should have separated the two parts of my post to be more clear who i was addressing.

now that you filled i the rest, i can see why they may have gotten upset, but in the original, you only said she replaced Earl with her ex's name.
i still don't get it, but it makes more sense

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:06 am 
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crazyface wrote:
Lonman wrote:
Alan B wrote:
mrscott wrote:
And it isn't the song itself that was the problem, it was what the young lady did while singing that same song.

I had a couple of ladies once who sang "Does He Love You". A duet by Reba McEntire & Linda Davis. Except they substituted the word "love" for "f*ck".
They would have been stopped in their tracks at my show due to the bar's rule against F bombs on the mic.



Maybe, but they'd have got the first one in, as you'd not know it was coming

but it was not part of the song

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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:16 am 
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If a person who behaves and speaks (uses profanity and is rude and vulgar) differently in front of different types of people (their grandma, children, coworkers, vs bar goes),,, we call those people,,, "hypocrites". Why on earth cannot a person show some dignity and maturity and still have fun? I just shake my head at some of the actions that people display and why we tolerate that behavior. I for one don't have to be a different person in front of anyone else. To quote Shakespeare, "To Thine Own Self Be True".


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 Post subject: Re: Profanity In Lyrics
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:35 am 
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True they may get their first one in, but it will be their last! Funny thing is the high majority of our crowds know this rule and they jump on the singer with the 'AH AH' before I even get to grab the fader lol.

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